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Anyone heard about the strange sales incentives for some client managers ?.
Here is how it works, the CM raises an NC against internal auditor training.
The client is then put in as a sales lead for training.
When the training sale is made with the same company as the Auditor the CM gets some money.
My immediate response to any auditor trying to do this would be to ask him which clause he is writing me up against.
There is NOTHING in the standard to say what training your internal auditors must have. As lead internal auditor with a training qualification, I train mine in-house and on-the-job, and they get a damn sight more information and support than they’ll get out of most external agencies.
9001:2015 also clearly indicates that it is up to companies to determine their own competency requirements. If I have documented that Internal Auditors may be untrained then there is nothing they can make stick.
Yeah, I used to see this sort of thing in the 90’s but it tapered off. The CBs are more aggressive about selling auditor training, but to their credit I don’t see them using audits to sell it. They do use audits to sell general “implementation” training which irks me, since that’s a direct competition to me. But whatever…
While I agree with the point that the client should argue with the finding, it is often easier to accept the issue and roll over. The Brits are not as good at debate as the Americans. The issue is one of power and being forced to accept Training from the certification body. While there is nothing in ISO 17021 that forbids this, it seems something that could lead to a risk to reputation for the CB. Perhaps is just ignored as the CB is so big.
I’d say that 90% of the time (based on my observations), US clients also roll over. It’s a calculation They have already spent tens of thousands of dollars on prepping for the audit, often just agreeing with the auditor and typing some words on paper is worth it. It’s not worth fighting over.